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The One I Left: I’ve restored the words "which adapted the tunes and phrasing of older folk songs" to the Lead, referring to "Girl From The North Country" and "A Hard Rain's a-Gonna Fall". I think it’s important that the Lead mentions Dylan first made an impact with these songs (and also "Masters of War", "Blowin’ in the Wind", "With God On Our Side") by marrying new lyrics to traditional melodies and forms. Best, Mick gold (talk) 23:16, 28 December 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Since the Lead serves as “a summary of the article’s most important contents”, BD’s talent for writing new lyrics to traditional tunes was surely crucial to the early impact he made with "Girl From The North Country", "A Hard Rain's a-Gonna Fall", "Masters of War", "Blowin’ in the Wind", "With God On Our Side" and more. Mick gold (talk) 08:12, 29 December 2024 (UTC)[reply]
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Just wondering why there is nothing at all about Buddy Holly in this article - seems an extraordinary gap given the abundant evidence that Buddy H was VERY big to Bob D. Is there some sort of systematic decision to shut Buddy H out here? Looks that way ... and I find this quite disturbing. 118.211.57.205 (talk) 13:58, 2 February 2025 (UTC)[reply]
I have added Dylan's account of seeing Buddy Holly perform in Duluth on January 31, 1959, quoting from Dylan's Nobel Prize lecture. Mick gold (talk) 20:27, 2 February 2025 (UTC)[reply]
Per MOS:NICKNAME, MOS:FULLNAME, and MOS:HYPOCORISM, Dylan's legal name should be mentioned first in this article, and "Bob" should be excluded. There is no need to have it written in such a complicated way. The "Bob" name does not need to be mentioned as it is a common hypocorism. This is the case on tons of other articles, including those who use the "Bob" name, such as Bob Marley and Bob Saget.
The first sentence should read:
Robert Dylan (born Robert Allen Zimmerman; May 24, 1941) is an American singer-songwriter.
I am aware this has been discussed before, but that was a year and a half ago, and I just cannot wrap my head around the fact that we are continuing to break Wikipedia's policies for no real reason. There were also many people who agreed with the above way of writing in the previous discussions. Strugglehouse (talk) 23:49, 10 February 2025 (UTC)[reply]
I think this links to the last time Dylan's name was discussed: [1] I'm in favor of beginning the article with the name this famous artist is universally known by, but let a thousand editors contend in search of a consensus. Mick gold (talk) 10:14, 11 February 2025 (UTC)[reply]
@Mick gold I just don't see the point in going against multiple guidelines for no real reason other than "I like it that way". Should we go to every article of someone who doesn't use their full legal name and move it into a bracket? Strugglehouse (talk) 10:30, 11 February 2025 (UTC)[reply]
I don't see the point of talking this over yet again. All these "rules" are guidelines, and if there are sufficient reasons to do something slightly different on a particular article, that's fine. This isn't something worth expending electrons over, even if they are cheap.Brianyoumans (talk) 15:02, 11 February 2025 (UTC)[reply]
Well, looking at the discussion Mick linked to above, how about this comment:
"It's because of the principle of least astonishment. Readers will have heard of Bob Dylan, and many will be aware that he was born Robert Allen Zimmerman. Many will also be aware that Bob Marley was born Robert Nesta Marley - it won't be a surprise to them that that was his legal name. But it will astonish many readers to find Bob Dylan's legal name of Robert Dylan - without any explanation - as the opening words of the article. It's a name which is rarely if ever used. Under most circumstances, WP:MOSNICKNAME works fine. But in this case its use comes across as excessively pedantic. Ghmyrtle (talk) 17:03, 20 February 2019 (UTC)"
@Brianyoumans To say that readers will be "astonished" to learn that someone called Bob is legally called Robert is a bit overkill. It's not that surprising in my opinion, especially since his birth name is also Robert. It's not like it's a completely different name. Strugglehouse (talk) 17:26, 11 February 2025 (UTC)[reply]
Australian critic Jack Marx credited Dylan with changing the persona of the rock star: "What cannot be disputed is that Dylan invented the arrogant, faux-cerebral posturing that has been the dominant style in rock since, with everyone from Mick Jagger to Eminem educating themselves from the Dylan handbook". Who is Jack Marx? Why is his opinion important enough to be included? Jack Upland (talk) 03:24, 12 February 2025 (UTC)[reply]
level-4 vital article is rated FA-class on Wikipedia's content assessment scale.
